Comments on: Those NJ.com forums http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/ by Jeff Jarvis Thu, 21 Aug 2008 20:42:24 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1 By: mike hodnov http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-36202 mike hodnov Fri, 07 Apr 2006 20:52:47 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-36202 <blockquote cite=""><a href="http://plancksconstant.org/blog1/2006/04/some_nj_legislators_are_complete_assholes.html" rel="nofollow">Some NJ legislators are complete assholes</a></blockquote> says, "Why not have a law requiring all persons who control and maintain public restrooms to register all users to prevent anonymous bathroom wall defamations? And if we do that, how will we ever know that blowjob Mary can be reached at 555-7769?"

Some NJ legislators are complete assholes

says, “Why not have a law requiring all persons who control and maintain public restrooms to register all users to prevent anonymous bathroom wall defamations? And if we do that, how will we ever know that blowjob Mary can be reached at 555-7769?”

]]> By: PCD http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-32385 PCD Wed, 15 Mar 2006 13:32:31 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-32385 I commented on March 7th at www.iowavoice.com about this stupid New Jersey bill. I think Mr. Biondi should focus on cleaning up the New Jersey political system and courts before he tackles the Internet and tries to violate people's Free Speech rights. I commented on March 7th at http://www.iowavoice.com about this stupid New Jersey bill. I think Mr. Biondi should focus on cleaning up the New Jersey political system and courts before he tackles the Internet and tries to violate people’s Free Speech rights.

]]> By: NJBIONDIZAPUCKINMORON http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-32259 NJBIONDIZAPUCKINMORON Wed, 15 Mar 2006 02:39:08 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-32259 MY GOD...YOU HAVE TO WONDER WHERE THEY GET PEOPLE THAT STUPID..JUST THE SHEER IGNORANCE OF FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHTS..PRIVIACY RIGHTS, AND HOW THE WEB OPERATES...JUST IS MINDBOGGLEING AT THE LEVEL OF STUPIDITY THIS NJ IDIOT HAS SET... AND BESIDES THE LEGAL AND CONSTITUTIONAL ISSUES HIS MORONIC IDEA VIOLATES, WHO THE HELL DECIDED THAT SOME DICKBRAIN FROM SOME TOILETBOWL LIKE NEW JERSEY CAN TELL THE REST OF THE USA WHAT THEY CAN DO... THE SHEER SHITBRAINED IDIOCY OF THAT IS AGIAN..MINDBOGGLEING... THE JERK SAID.. THEY DIDNT LIKE HOW SOME PEOPLE ON LOCAL BOARDS TALKED... WELL...MR NJ SHITFORBRAINS.. IF YOU DONT LIKE YOUR NEIGHBORS LANGUAGE... MOVE... LEAVE THE STATE..TURN OFF YOUR COMPUTER... GO TO MR. BILLS WEBSITE... TALK WITH BIGBIRD... BUT WHO THE HELL DO YOU THINK YOU ARE THAT YOU CAN DICTATE TO THE REST OF THE WORLD...GO KISS OUR ASS YOU SHITHEADED BIRDBRAIN.... MY GOD…YOU HAVE TO WONDER WHERE THEY GET PEOPLE THAT STUPID..JUST THE SHEER IGNORANCE OF FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHTS..PRIVIACY RIGHTS, AND HOW THE WEB OPERATES…JUST IS MINDBOGGLEING AT THE LEVEL OF STUPIDITY THIS NJ IDIOT HAS SET…
AND BESIDES THE LEGAL AND CONSTITUTIONAL ISSUES HIS MORONIC IDEA VIOLATES, WHO THE HELL DECIDED THAT SOME DICKBRAIN FROM SOME TOILETBOWL LIKE NEW JERSEY CAN TELL THE REST OF THE USA WHAT THEY CAN DO… THE SHEER SHITBRAINED IDIOCY OF THAT IS AGIAN..MINDBOGGLEING… THE JERK SAID.. THEY DIDNT LIKE HOW SOME PEOPLE ON LOCAL BOARDS TALKED… WELL…MR NJ SHITFORBRAINS.. IF YOU DONT LIKE YOUR NEIGHBORS LANGUAGE… MOVE… LEAVE THE STATE..TURN OFF YOUR COMPUTER… GO TO MR. BILLS WEBSITE… TALK WITH BIGBIRD… BUT WHO THE HELL DO YOU THINK YOU ARE THAT YOU CAN DICTATE TO THE REST OF THE WORLD…GO KISS OUR ASS YOU SHITHEADED BIRDBRAIN….

]]> By: Ofer Nave http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31866 Ofer Nave Fri, 10 Mar 2006 18:10:23 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31866 Thanks for fighting the good fight. Thanks for fighting the good fight.

]]> By: The Starving Marketer’s Blog » Blog Archive » Jersey Lawmaker: Let’s Squelch What Makes Web Debate Great http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31800 The Starving Marketer’s Blog » Blog Archive » Jersey Lawmaker: Let’s Squelch What Makes Web Debate Great Fri, 10 Mar 2006 02:10:54 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31800 [...] Needless to say, the Web freedom crew is up-in-arms over this one, even though it’s too silly to be enacted. Even Biondi’s backing off it now. Chief among Biondi’s detractors is non other than Buzzmachine’s Jeff Jarvis, who seems to be taking credit for Biondi’s bill backlash against naughty forum posts. He, afterall, helped create the online media powerhouse that is NJ.com (and its affiliates across the country*), and, its well-populated forums. Writes Jarvis, “I am damned proud to have started the forums that caused New Jersey Assemblyman Peter Biondi to propose the stupidest legislation in memory (well, at least since Raritan, NJ, tried to outlaw cursing).” [...] [...] Needless to say, the Web freedom crew is up-in-arms over this one, even though it’s too silly to be enacted. Even Biondi’s backing off it now. Chief among Biondi’s detractors is non other than Buzzmachine’s Jeff Jarvis, who seems to be taking credit for Biondi’s bill backlash against naughty forum posts. He, afterall, helped create the online media powerhouse that is NJ.com (and its affiliates across the country*), and, its well-populated forums. Writes Jarvis, “I am damned proud to have started the forums that caused New Jersey Assemblyman Peter Biondi to propose the stupidest legislation in memory (well, at least since Raritan, NJ, tried to outlaw cursing).” [...]

]]> By: RonP http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31755 RonP Thu, 09 Mar 2006 13:59:44 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31755 this is somewhat similiar to the blog suit that was shot down in delaware. Jeff: have you spoken to any of the parties down there? this is somewhat similiar to the blog suit that was shot down in delaware. Jeff: have you spoken to any of the parties down there?

]]> By: RonP http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31753 RonP Thu, 09 Mar 2006 13:51:25 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31753 as a former NJ resident (of somerset county - Biondi was my assemblyman) i can only tell you how glad i am to be gone. NJ is fast on its way to the same meltdown as was only narrowly averted in california. difference is they have none of the views nor the weather. have fun. Biondi, like the rest of the NJ govt is a clown who fiddles while Bayonne burns. oops, sorry commissar. as a former NJ resident (of somerset county - Biondi was my assemblyman) i can only tell you how glad i am to be gone. NJ is fast on its way to the same meltdown as was only narrowly averted in california. difference is they have none of the views nor the weather. have fun. Biondi, like the rest of the NJ govt is a clown who fiddles while Bayonne burns. oops, sorry commissar.

]]> By: Ruth http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31752 Ruth Thu, 09 Mar 2006 13:46:41 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31752 The forum form is a good attempt to bring a blog mentality into the compass of a formal meeting, but it brings along blog quirks, which include occasional outrageous expressions. Like Jeff, I think bad language is out of place, but I recognize that there are viable bloggers who think it's necessary to express themselves adequately. If simple rules are set up that just demand that profanity is prohibited, isn't that enough to keep participants in the game unless they choose to violate the standard and are excluded by their own choice? The WaPo discussion that Jeff participated in degenerated, imho, because the WaPo itself would not report accurately, refusing to correct the original mistake of Howell's article, and kept insisting that Abramoff had contributed to Dems [the alternate form being that Abramoff's clients could stand in for him, himself]. If the press won't report accurately, then the discussors refused to keep to language standards, sort of a tit for tat. The forum form is a good attempt to bring a blog mentality into the compass of a formal meeting, but it brings along blog quirks, which include occasional outrageous expressions. Like Jeff, I think bad language is out of place, but I recognize that there are viable bloggers who think it’s necessary to express themselves adequately. If simple rules are set up that just demand that profanity is prohibited, isn’t that enough to keep participants in the game unless they choose to violate the standard and are excluded by their own choice?

The WaPo discussion that Jeff participated in degenerated, imho, because the WaPo itself would not report accurately, refusing to correct the original mistake of Howell’s article, and kept insisting that Abramoff had contributed to Dems [the alternate form being that Abramoff's clients could stand in for him, himself]. If the press won’t report accurately, then the discussors refused to keep to language standards, sort of a tit for tat.

]]> By: Cal http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31739 Cal Thu, 09 Mar 2006 09:29:37 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31739 <i>I’ve argued for five years that blogs are a notch up the evolutionary scale of conversation for two reasons: First, there is a proprietorship, an ownership and a pride in blogs. People put their names or their brands behind what they say and they don’t want to mess that up. Second, the links mean that the cream — by any definition — rises</i> Oh, please. The two aren't even comparable. A blog is a house. The owner can let people in or keep people out. He can let his buddies in and kick out enemies. He can be as rude or as polite as he chooses. Most importantly, the primary function of a blog is to promote the owner's viewpoint. A forum is a common ground. By definition, the forum doesn't exist without a huge number of voices that are all equal, if not of equal value to everyone else. The forum's primary function is to promote interaction and information exchange, not one viewpoint. A blog is talk radio. A forum has no real equivalent in any other medium. It's fine to prefer one to the other. It's simply inaccurate to pretend that one is an evolution from the other. Also, perhaps I'm misreading you and Declan, but it appears you think this bill would only apply to "forums" as an interactive website format. If one or both of you think that blogs and blog comments wouldn't be bound by the same law, what the hell have you been smoking? If I misunderstood, phew. Finally, even if this law passed, which it almost certainly wouldn't, it wouldn't squelch a single post. It would just end webhosting services in New Jersey. I’ve argued for five years that blogs are a notch up the evolutionary scale of conversation for two reasons: First, there is a proprietorship, an ownership and a pride in blogs. People put their names or their brands behind what they say and they don’t want to mess that up. Second, the links mean that the cream — by any definition — rises

Oh, please. The two aren’t even comparable. A blog is a house. The owner can let people in or keep people out. He can let his buddies in and kick out enemies. He can be as rude or as polite as he chooses. Most importantly, the primary function of a blog is to promote the owner’s viewpoint.

A forum is a common ground. By definition, the forum doesn’t exist without a huge number of voices that are all equal, if not of equal value to everyone else. The forum’s primary function is to promote interaction and information exchange, not one viewpoint.

A blog is talk radio. A forum has no real equivalent in any other medium.

It’s fine to prefer one to the other. It’s simply inaccurate to pretend that one is an evolution from the other.

Also, perhaps I’m misreading you and Declan, but it appears you think this bill would only apply to “forums” as an interactive website format. If one or both of you think that blogs and blog comments wouldn’t be bound by the same law, what the hell have you been smoking? If I misunderstood, phew.

Finally, even if this law passed, which it almost certainly wouldn’t, it wouldn’t squelch a single post. It would just end webhosting services in New Jersey.

]]> By: triticale http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31728 triticale Thu, 09 Mar 2006 04:22:17 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31728 I to believe in the value of identity. That's why I created a unique one which does not carry the True Name I share with others including a third-tier celebrity. I to believe in the value of identity. That’s why I created a unique one which does not carry the True Name I share with others including a third-tier celebrity.

]]> By: Have Coffee Will Write » CEDING POWER… http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31720 Have Coffee Will Write » CEDING POWER… Wed, 08 Mar 2006 23:34:39 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31720 [...] If I had a nickel for everytime I typed it’s all about the conversation, I’d have a lot of nickels. Jeff Jarvis this afternoon highlights one of the reasons the rich and powerful hate Meet The Bloggers: they don’t want to cede power by having a conversation. Jarvis is talking about a set of forums, but the message is universal. He writes: [...] [...] If I had a nickel for everytime I typed it’s all about the conversation, I’d have a lot of nickels. Jeff Jarvis this afternoon highlights one of the reasons the rich and powerful hate Meet The Bloggers: they don’t want to cede power by having a conversation. Jarvis is talking about a set of forums, but the message is universal. He writes: [...]

]]> By: David R. Block http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31711 David R. Block Wed, 08 Mar 2006 20:59:22 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31711 If the bloke wants online civility enforced, let him start his own forum and moderate it himself. If he can turn on a computer. On the wanker scale, Biondi has our host beat, by, I dunno, the length of I-10 through Texas (around 900 miles)? If the bloke wants online civility enforced, let him start his own forum and moderate it himself.

If he can turn on a computer.

On the wanker scale, Biondi has our host beat, by, I dunno, the length of I-10 through Texas (around 900 miles)?

]]> By: htom http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31707 htom Wed, 08 Mar 2006 20:26:50 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31707 This is a great example of the difference between Carse's <i> Finite and Infinite Games</i>. Professional politician, thinking he is playing a finite game, thinks he has won and the losers may only speak as he allows. Voters and posters know that he was playing that game with his opponents, not them, and they won't be silent. This is a great example of the difference between Carse’s Finite and Infinite Games. Professional politician, thinking he is playing a finite game, thinks he has won and the losers may only speak as he allows. Voters and posters know that he was playing that game with his opponents, not them, and they won’t be silent.

]]> By: Grayson http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31701 Grayson Wed, 08 Mar 2006 20:02:39 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31701 Heck, that's nothin'! The dude would be crowned King in Georgia. We've got idiotic Rep-written legislation passing through our Senate and House fasternin', say, NASCAR can zoom-off to N.C. Heck, that’s nothin’! The dude would be crowned King in Georgia. We’ve got idiotic Rep-written legislation passing through our Senate and House fasternin’, say, NASCAR can zoom-off to N.C.

]]> By: Ross M Karchner http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31700 Ross M Karchner Wed, 08 Mar 2006 20:01:52 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31700 Somewhat related, there some interesting backlash happening after some censorship on the forums of Pennlive, one of NJ.com's sister sites. Cruise through http://harrisburghappening.blogspot.com/ I'm not associated with the site (and I don't even live in Harrisburg anymore), just an interested observer Somewhat related, there some interesting backlash happening after some censorship on the forums of Pennlive, one of NJ.com’s sister sites.

Cruise through http://harrisburghappening.blogspot.com/

I’m not associated with the site (and I don’t even live in Harrisburg anymore), just an interested observer

]]> By: Mithras http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31699 Mithras Wed, 08 Mar 2006 19:46:23 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31699 Good job, Jarvis. Although you're still a wanker. Good job, Jarvis. Although you’re still a wanker.

]]> By: JennyD http://www.buzzmachine.com/2006/03/08/those-njcom-forums/#comment-31698 JennyD Wed, 08 Mar 2006 19:45:16 +0000 http://www.buzzmachine.com/?p=1231#comment-31698 Jeff, I agree with you about forums. Very powerful ways for people to talk to each other. But I live in a community served by forums run by the same company, and I have to say that many people hate the format. It's clunky, hard to follow. At time when technology has made it easy for people to talk and comment, the Advance/Newhouse websites remain incredibly hard to use. I agree that they are a good thing, but I think the implementation on this company's sites is not what it could be. and I think this legislation is ridiculous. Jeff, I agree with you about forums. Very powerful ways for people to talk to each other.

But I live in a community served by forums run by the same company, and I have to say that many people hate the format. It’s clunky, hard to follow. At time when technology has made it easy for people to talk and comment, the Advance/Newhouse websites remain incredibly hard to use. I agree that they are a good thing, but I think the implementation on this company’s sites is not what it could be.

and I think this legislation is ridiculous.

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