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	<title>Comments on: Rules for journalists/bloggers/witnesses? A Guardian debate</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/</link>
	<description>by Jeff Jarvis</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 25 Jul 2008 08:35:43 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Andy Freeman</title>
		<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-374026</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy Freeman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Apr 2008 18:20:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-374026</guid>
		<description>If paying money to attend is a problem, does that mean that reviewers are only journalists if they're comp'd?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If paying money to attend is a problem, does that mean that reviewers are only journalists if they&#8217;re comp&#8217;d?</p>
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		<title>By: The vulnerability in uncharted territory. &#171; andrew golis</title>
		<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-374016</link>
		<dc:creator>The vulnerability in uncharted territory. &#171; andrew golis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Apr 2008 12:13:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-374016</guid>
		<description>[...] Jarvis, in a debate with Tomasky on his piece, embraces a kind of radical transparency.Â  If public figures know that they are constantly vulnerable, he argues, they&#8217;ll become more [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Jarvis, in a debate with Tomasky on his piece, embraces a kind of radical transparency.Â  If public figures know that they are constantly vulnerable, he argues, they&#8217;ll become more [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Guy Love</title>
		<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373994</link>
		<dc:creator>Guy Love</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Apr 2008 22:53:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373994</guid>
		<description>The media will be dragged kicking and screaming into the worldview that Jeff presented.  This is a function of technology and decentralization.  Trying to regulate this change will only isolate the regulators from the wide open content stream flowing through the blogosphere on a daily basis.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The media will be dragged kicking and screaming into the worldview that Jeff presented.  This is a function of technology and decentralization.  Trying to regulate this change will only isolate the regulators from the wide open content stream flowing through the blogosphere on a daily basis.</p>
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		<title>By: links for 2008-04-26 &#124; Jonathan Coffman - Convergence Journalism Specialist and New-Media Evangelist</title>
		<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373910</link>
		<dc:creator>links for 2008-04-26 &#124; Jonathan Coffman - Convergence Journalism Specialist and New-Media Evangelist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Apr 2008 20:51:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373910</guid>
		<description>[...] BuzzMachine Â» Blog Archive Â» Rules for journalists/bloggers/witnesses? A Guardian debate [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] BuzzMachine Â» Blog Archive Â» Rules for journalists/bloggers/witnesses? A Guardian debate [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Watch this. &#171; andrew golis</title>
		<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373901</link>
		<dc:creator>Watch this. &#171; andrew golis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 26 Apr 2008 19:13:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373901</guid>
		<description>[...]  I&#8217;m working on a post on the debate between Jeff Jarvis and Michael Tomasky about whether new media has rules.Â  In the meantime, this conversation between Jarvis and PDF [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...]  I&#8217;m working on a post on the debate between Jeff Jarvis and Michael Tomasky about whether new media has rules.Â  In the meantime, this conversation between Jarvis and PDF [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Gary Imhoff</title>
		<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373858</link>
		<dc:creator>Gary Imhoff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 20:39:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373858</guid>
		<description>Did Michael Tomasky raise the same objections to citizen journalism and "gotcha" moments in the George Allen "macaca" controversy? When the Washington Post ran a front-page story every day for weeks elevating Allen's one-time use of a word none of us had ever heard of before into a poisonous racial insult and the only issue in the campaign, did Tomasky bemoan the fact that an activist supporter of an opposing campaign had followed a politician around filiming his every word in hopes of catching a "gotcha" moment? 

In the Obama case, the citizen journalist was not an opponent, but an active supporter of Obama, who recorded his presentation for her own use, but then realized that what she had was newsworthy, and overcame her own political preferences to release the recording.  And what Obama said was not one wrong word, but a revealing statement of his beliefs that was consistent with what he had said in the past. 

I suspect that Tomasky's objection is not to a new type of citizen journalism, but to whose ox was gored in this case.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Did Michael Tomasky raise the same objections to citizen journalism and &#8220;gotcha&#8221; moments in the George Allen &#8220;macaca&#8221; controversy? When the Washington Post ran a front-page story every day for weeks elevating Allen&#8217;s one-time use of a word none of us had ever heard of before into a poisonous racial insult and the only issue in the campaign, did Tomasky bemoan the fact that an activist supporter of an opposing campaign had followed a politician around filiming his every word in hopes of catching a &#8220;gotcha&#8221; moment? </p>
<p>In the Obama case, the citizen journalist was not an opponent, but an active supporter of Obama, who recorded his presentation for her own use, but then realized that what she had was newsworthy, and overcame her own political preferences to release the recording.  And what Obama said was not one wrong word, but a revealing statement of his beliefs that was consistent with what he had said in the past. </p>
<p>I suspect that Tomasky&#8217;s objection is not to a new type of citizen journalism, but to whose ox was gored in this case.</p>
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		<title>By: Rosenblum</title>
		<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373856</link>
		<dc:creator>Rosenblum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 19:53:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373856</guid>
		<description>Free presses are messy. Wasn;t it HL Mencken who said "free presses are free for those who can afford them". Well, now anyone can - and its going to get really free and really messy. Good. Finally we'll get some decent reporting!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Free presses are messy. Wasn;t it HL Mencken who said &#8220;free presses are free for those who can afford them&#8221;. Well, now anyone can - and its going to get really free and really messy. Good. Finally we&#8217;ll get some decent reporting!</p>
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		<title>By: Jay Rosen</title>
		<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373855</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay Rosen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 18:49:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373855</guid>
		<description>I am with ya on all of that, Andrew.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am with ya on all of that, Andrew.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Tyndall</title>
		<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373854</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Tyndall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 18:23:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373854</guid>
		<description>No, Jay --

What is left is the question Tomasky repeated in the final paragraph: is it fair for someone who has access to a room in one capacity (a donor) to act in another capacity (a witness/transcriber/reporter/journalist) after leaving the room?

Clearly this question is hypothetical in this instance since, as you point out, the Obama Campaign's event was not off the record and it had an expectation of coverage.

But what if it had not been? In an instance when one is invited to listen to something that is private and is told that it is so, surely one is bound not to repeat it, however newsworthy it might happen to be, and being a journalist -- or calling oneself a journalist -- is no license to violate that understanding and make such speech public.

That point does not fall under "rules for bloggers." It falls under rules for human beings.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, Jay &#8211;</p>
<p>What is left is the question Tomasky repeated in the final paragraph: is it fair for someone who has access to a room in one capacity (a donor) to act in another capacity (a witness/transcriber/reporter/journalist) after leaving the room?</p>
<p>Clearly this question is hypothetical in this instance since, as you point out, the Obama Campaign&#8217;s event was not off the record and it had an expectation of coverage.</p>
<p>But what if it had not been? In an instance when one is invited to listen to something that is private and is told that it is so, surely one is bound not to repeat it, however newsworthy it might happen to be, and being a journalist &#8212; or calling oneself a journalist &#8212; is no license to violate that understanding and make such speech public.</p>
<p>That point does not fall under &#8220;rules for bloggers.&#8221; It falls under rules for human beings.</p>
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		<title>By: Jay Rosen</title>
		<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373841</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay Rosen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 13:37:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373841</guid>
		<description>"Itâ€™s just that these things do get blown out of proportion, and it gets comical (or sometimes worse) watching millionaire pundits natter on about 'elitism.'"

Did Mayhill Fowler blow his comments out of proportion?  No, that was done by Michael Tomasky's colleagues in the pro press.  Her report was extremely restrained and it noted in it that she remained an Obama supporter.  Did she go on for days and days about elitism?  No, that was Tomasky's colleagues in the pro press-- and the other two candidates.

According to the Obama campaign, the event was not off-the-record, the Obama campaign said it expects these things to be recorded and posted, she was invited as a known blogger, and according to Tomasky she served the public interest. 

What's left?  "She's not a journalist!"</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Itâ€™s just that these things do get blown out of proportion, and it gets comical (or sometimes worse) watching millionaire pundits natter on about &#8216;elitism.&#8217;&#8221;</p>
<p>Did Mayhill Fowler blow his comments out of proportion?  No, that was done by Michael Tomasky&#8217;s colleagues in the pro press.  Her report was extremely restrained and it noted in it that she remained an Obama supporter.  Did she go on for days and days about elitism?  No, that was Tomasky&#8217;s colleagues in the pro press&#8211; and the other two candidates.</p>
<p>According to the Obama campaign, the event was not off-the-record, the Obama campaign said it expects these things to be recorded and posted, she was invited as a known blogger, and according to Tomasky she served the public interest. </p>
<p>What&#8217;s left?  &#8220;She&#8217;s not a journalist!&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: links for 2008-04-24 &#171; andrew golis</title>
		<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373820</link>
		<dc:creator>links for 2008-04-24 &#171; andrew golis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 23:43:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373820</guid>
		<description>[...] BuzzMachine Â» Blog Archive Â» Rules for journalists/bloggers/witnesses? A Guardian debate Smart dudes. (tags: new.media tomasky jeff.jarvis buzzmachine) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] BuzzMachine Â» Blog Archive Â» Rules for journalists/bloggers/witnesses? A Guardian debate Smart dudes. (tags: new.media tomasky jeff.jarvis buzzmachine) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: roger rainey</title>
		<link>http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373818</link>
		<dc:creator>roger rainey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Apr 2008 23:00:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.buzzmachine.com/2008/04/24/guardian-debate-rules-for-journalistsbloggerswitnesses/#comment-373818</guid>
		<description>Really interesting discussion, as usual Jeff. For me, this provides circumstantial evidence that bias unconsciously affects the way journalists see and report things, because I think each of your positions on Fowler's actions are influenced by their effect on your preferred candidate. But moreover, good God, isn't advocating for rules on citizen journalists like tilting at windmills, especially in a world where some bloggers only go by a pseudonym. I think bloggers' currency is their credibility and that naturally drives certain unwritten rules, but there will be no central body dictating them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Really interesting discussion, as usual Jeff. For me, this provides circumstantial evidence that bias unconsciously affects the way journalists see and report things, because I think each of your positions on Fowler&#8217;s actions are influenced by their effect on your preferred candidate. But moreover, good God, isn&#8217;t advocating for rules on citizen journalists like tilting at windmills, especially in a world where some bloggers only go by a pseudonym. I think bloggers&#8217; currency is their credibility and that naturally drives certain unwritten rules, but there will be no central body dictating them.</p>
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